Interview
with Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, El Tiempo (Colombia), August
19, 2003
Secretary
Rumsfeld Interview with El Tiempo, Bogota, Colombia
Q: How was the meeting with President Uribe and the Colombian Generals?
Rumsfeld:
Just terrific! I have a great deal of respect for him. He is a man of
vision. He is a man of personal courage. He is an individual who is
purposeful. I have met with him previously and each time I am with him
I come away thinking that the world would be a somewhat better place
if we had more leaders of his talent and his determination.
Q: What
did you talk about with the Generals?
Rumsfeld:
We had a good meeting at the Ministry of Defense. We had lunch with
them first. We had a very long discussion on every conceivable topic.
Then we went over to the Ministry of Defense and had a meeting specifically
with them. General Mora talked at some length about his plan and where
he feels they are with respect to the progress here in Colombia and
the relationship between the United States and the Military of Colombia.
It was a very a good meeting. The Minister was there, and General Mora,
as well as the senior military officials.
Q: Three
days ago, President Uribe was very angry with some results of military
operations. Do you know something about that?
Rumsfeld:
I dont.
Q: The
Minister of Defense talks about the Colombian need for real-time satellite
information. Did you talk about that?
Rumsfeld:
That subject came up. The militaries of the world are organized to fight
armies, navies and air forces, and they get good at that. They organize,
they train, they equip, they practice and have exercises; and all of
a sudden we are in a world where the problem is not so much with armies,
navies or air forces but with terrorist networks, terrorist organizations,
asymmetric threats, cyber attacks, problems with attacks on space capabilities.
What that does is it suddenly changes circumstances for the military,
and what they have to do is to pause and recognize that they have to
adjust how they organize, how they train, how they equip, how they maneuver,
how they operate, and it calls for a more agile military. It calls for
a greater use of special operations forces that are distinctive in the
kinds of things they do. It puts a much greater premium on intelligence
gathering and it requires the fusing of intelligence, the different
types of intelligence: human intelligence and electronic intelligence,
satellite intelligence. She is right to focus on those things because
they are one element in the new security environment that free people
are now living in and we have to learn how to live in that environment.
So, there are things that can be done that will better equip us to live
in this security environment.
Q: Can
we expect some changes in training of the Colombia troops, more equipment?
Rumsfeld:
Sure, not for everybody, but for elements of our militaries, ours and
NATO, and Colombias and other countries; we are all asking questions.
What are the lessons that we have learned in the last five years, what
does it tell us about the kinds of things that we have to learn to do
differently and better, what will happen? General Hill, who has been
meeting with the Colombian military, will come back to the United States
at some point and General Myers who was just here, and there will be
discussions and asking the question what are the kinds of things that
as the Colombian government and military have success, their circumstances
changed somewhat, and therefore how we can work with them and be helpful
to them changes somewhat as well.
They will
be looking to refine that relationship as they go through the coming
weeks and months. I suspect that the way we are working together today
is different than we were a year ago, and a year ago is different than
the year before that, and next year will be different as well because
of the kinds of changes and adjustments that will be made.
Q: How
do you see the damage that drugs are doing to the region?
Rumsfeld:
Drugs are an enormous problem for the world. The damage that it does
to human lives and the million of dollars that it puts in the hands
of criminals, terrorists, hostage takers, people who are trying to deny
freedom and opportunity to other people; it poses a very serious threat
to the world. Drugs are fueling terrorism and terrorist networks and
it is something that like-thinking people need to work together to deal
with. It is a regional problem, it is a global problem in a very real
sense. It is not simply a problem that one country can deal with alone.
The drug problem, if you isolate it, is in many respects a demand problem
as well as supply problem and it is an education problem. I dont
know how much more education the world ought to need, when you see the
carnage from heroine and cocaine, spread in country after country, the
human damage that is done. But it is more than just that problem. Those
billions of dollars are available to people who are willing to sell
drugs and do that damage and who are antisocial, who do not believe
in legitimate governments, and free people, and civil societies, and
normal behavior. They are people who take hostages; they are people
who try to terrorize other people. It is in the interest of all like-thinking
people who want to be free and want to live sensible lives to be against
that with determination and conviction. As I say, I am enormously impressed
with this national security teams conviction as well as the success
that it achieves.
Q: Did
your see the story a couple of weeks ago that the U.S. Government compared
Venezuela with Syria?
Rumsfeld:
I am told that is not true. I dont know; I wasnt here. And
the U.S. government doesnt have a voice, so it had to be a person
as opposed to a government. Right? Buildings dont talk. I was
told that by somebody else and they corrected the questioner and said
that they didnt think that is what that gentleman said. I was
not there so I dont know. I am old fashioned; I like to engage
my brain before my mouth.
Q: We have
a kind of a peace process with paramilitary groups known as a terrorist
organization, with the AUC.
Rumsfeld:
That is something that the Colombian Government is engaged in. To the
extent the United States is knowledgeable about it, it would be to the
Department of State, not the Department of Defense. I am not up to speed
on it. All I would say is that in life things tend not to be simple,
they tend not to be all one way; they tend not to be only military,
or only political, or only economic, or only diplomatic. It does not
surprise me that if you look in other countries in the world, there
are terrorist organizations that are in discussions with government.
Sometimes they are successful; sometimes they are not. In this instance,
I am not knowledgeable enough to talk about it.
Q: They
are talking about freezing the extradition process in the government,
so that involves the American Government.
Rumsfeld:
In another department, so I will take a pass.
Moderator:
You have time for one last question.
Rumsfeld:
Make it a pill.
Q: You
dont travel very often. How come we are one of those few countries
you go to?
Rumsfeld:
I travel to places that are important to the United States and the Department
of Defense. I travel to places where we are engaged in some sort of
partnership or alliance or relationship. I travel to places where we
have U.S. Military people engaged. We are in the same hemisphere. Colombia
is an important country in this hemisphere. It is a country that is
on the front line of the global war on terrorism. It is a country that
I felt I wanted to show and demonstrate my support for, and my encouragement
and respect.
Thank you.
As of August
20, 2003, this document was also available online at http://www.defenselink.mil/transcripts/2003/tr20030819-secdef0603.html